Update on BoBo

[bird-lover34]

Hello Everyone, It has been a few weeks since I posted BoBo's (formerly Romeo) progress. It seems we have traded a couple of behaviors for others not so good. I let him climb out of his cage every morning before he has breakfast. So he is hungry and that is when I try to do the clicker training. He has within the last few days refused to step, either on a perch or on my hand. Don't know why the sudden refusal,unless he is just bored with the activity. I was having a problem getting him to go back in his cage and even had to use the butterfly net on him a couple of times a few weeks ago. I have been putting several unshelled peanuts in his food dish and also a few sticking out of a round toy ball with holes in it like a whiffle ball only bigger. After about an hour he eventually will go in on his own. He has a little apple that holds one peanut in it. I hang that low so he can "find" it. But a couple of times the little dickens has climbed down the outside of the cage and tried to get it through the bars so he wouldn't have to go in. LOL.
I found a large plastic spoon that probably was a scoop for a childs sand box and BoBo fell in love with that spoon. The only thing is, he chewed open the handle so I put a tight rubber band around it and put it in his cage. He dropped it, went down and retreived it, dragging it all the way up the branch holding it with one foot. He got it up to his perch and began working on the handle again. So I started to take it from him so I could glue it back together since he loves it so much, and he stepped back, growled at me and hugged it close to his chest. It was like he was saying "NO! It's mine!!!" LOL

Anyway, I glued it with super glue, the next day gave it back to him and within minutes he had it split apart again. Do you think I should not let him have it now because he might get a fragment of glue in his beak? He just dearly loves that stupid spoon that I hate to keep it from him. Right now it has the rubber band around it but he can still pry it open a little bit.

Biggest problem now is that he doesn't want to train anymore. Should I just leave him alone about training for awhile and resume later on or what? He still will only put one foot up. He's not afraid of me anymore, I can get in his cage to change toys and change water & food dishes, arrange perches etc and he sits very calmly and doesn't react to my hands being in the cage. Just can't move my hands toward him is all.

He doesn't squawk very loud anymore at night like he used to. He just makes this sweet little "awwwww" sound. And he doesn't say BoBo anymore, he only did that when he was squawking really loud. So there are changes, I just don't know if these are signs he is happy or just bored. He plays with his toys now all the time, I rotate them every few days, he is becoming much less fearful around my husband now. Other than these small concerns, he is doing great.
Thanks for your advice and support
Vel

[vmtwriter]

He fell in love with a spoon? How adorable. And he won't let you have it. Too funny. I'm sure there are others on here who can help with advice on his training. I'll kick this back up to the top so someone can see the message.

[Jean]

Hi Vel, It's good to hear from you.

I am glad to hear BoBo is happy and loves his shovel. Him loving it so much makes me think it may be worth a trip to go to the toy section at the dollar store or Wal Mart to pick up some more similar ones. Then I'd bet he will turn loose of the old one.

Safety concerns: Please, be careful using glues on anything a bird may be in contact with. I do not know of a bird safe glue. They are like a baby, everything goes in their mouth. Good Luck, enjoy your little BoBo.

Please, keep us posted how you and BoBo are doing.

[Shirley]

Thank you for the update on Bobo! Sounds like he's doing a very good job of training you! :heart: :wub: Seriously, he is conditioning you to behave the way he wants you to behave. But if you are both happy, and you don't mind, and he's safe, then no problem, unless you ever have to get him out of the house in a hurry for his safety, or off to the vet, or treat a broken blood feather, etc. I am not saying that sarcastically, not at all... but those are things to consider. The longer you wait, the harder it will be.

I'd get him a basketful of those spoons and give him a new one once he tears up the old one. Like Jean said, no glue. Too dangerous, and besides, glue isn't going to stop his strong beak. :)

If I were in your situation, I would invite an experienced bird person over to show me how to work with him, to give me a little head start on how to work with him. You'll be amazed at how quickly he'll respond to you once he learns you are confident and not intimidated by him. Also, he'll never trust you so long as you use a net or any other "trapping" devices. Put yourself in a bird's place...he's the prey... he doesn't want to feel trapped. That's a very scary insecure place to be.

Is he flighted or has he been clipped? Until you have him stepping up and responding well to you, I recommend a wingclip by an avian vet or *experienced* bird person.

Please keep us posted - we're here to offer you support and guidance and wish you all the best with him :tighthug:

[bird-lover34]

Hi everyone!
I am having a dickens of a time getting BoBo back in his cage after letting him out. the last two times I have let him out, he refused to do any stepping up training at all! No matter what I enticed him with. So I just backed off and we didn't do any training but he also didn't get any treats. After 3 hours he was still on top his cage and WOULD NOT go in. I had a doctor's appointment and needed for him to go back in. I tried everything. Put whole peanuts in his food dish, and in his toys. No luck. Finally, I picked up the butterfly net and he flew as soon as he saw it. I eventually got him netted and when he was in the net, he just stopped resisting. It was like he knew I was going to put him back in his cage and he wouldn't be hurt. He can see through the net so I don't think it was a scary situation with him. He just doesn't want to go back in until he gets good and ready but that could mean all day long and I can't leave him unattended to go in another room or not even to the bathroom! (Meanwhile the dogs are penned up)
I have come to the conclusion we are not going to get anywhere until he will sit on the T perch or step up on a perch. And to accomplish that, I just don't think he is going to do it while he is on top his cage where he is in command. I have to get him off that cage and in another room but how? The only way I know of is to net him.
I have put new toys in his cage but it is not enough to get him back in. He loves to play with them but only after he has been returned to his cage either by force or his own choice. Problem is, his choice is not always convenient. When he DOES go in by himself (not often) I click him and praise him and give him an extra treat. It just isn't enough to motivate him. He is not the least bit afraid me. He will get within inches of my face when I am talking to him and will walk all around the top of the cage and come back face to face with me. So I just don't think it is a matter of "trust". If he didn't trust me, why would he risk getting that close to me? He just doesn't realize all the wonderful things that would come his way if he would just step up!
Meantime, Mama is still frustrated. There has GOT to be a way.......!!!!??!?!?!?!
Vel

[Shirley]

Do you have the Clicker Training for Birds book by Melinda Johnson? I must explain that you are not clicker training him, you are just clicking every once in awhile and giving him a treat.

So long as he is flighted, he is certainly in control. Please, please read my post above yours (maybe again) and consider getting someone experienced with parrots to help you with him. I would have him clipped asap and then begin routine training once you have been taught some basic training skills. This is so important for both yours and his safety, happiness, and well-being.

Here are some clicker training videos for you to see:

http://shirleymorgan.com/misc/CT/

Please do keep us posted ~ :wub:

[Jim]

Hello Vel
I understand your frustration, believe me. I'm going to say some things I've learned and use from the study of ABA (applied behavioral analysis), learning about natural behaviors, and working with birds in general. Take a deep breath relax and don't take what I type personal.

Parrots are prey animals and only want to be in "command" of their own life, they do not want to be our boss, in charge of us, or be bossed by us. Through observation of their environment and the people in it they make their own decisions on how to interact or behavior. Choices. Trust is an easy word to say but observing trust is a different story. BoBo may trust you enough to get close to your face but not trust your hands. Your hands may signal the net is coming and back to the cage. Make since so far? My birds trust me, they do not trust all people, they only begin to trust others by observing how the person interacts with them. If you were to come to my home my birds would fly by you, land close, and generally watch you. If all went well they would probably land on your head or shoulder. Why your head or shoulder you may ask, even may think my birds are ill behaved. They are simply testing the water by landing where they feel safe and able to get away if need be. If a person reaches for them they don't bite, fight, or dominate the person, they fly off - their choice. The bird did nothing wrong, the person did by pushing the trust issue. Funny how living with birds has so many varying opinions isn't it. I've been told my birds aren't social because of these types of actions. I say they are happy, confident birds that do not live in fear or stress. Just my opinion.

If it were me I would work on getting BoBo to "want" to go in his cage. The cage should be a safe place that he feels at home in. Be inventive, watch him and try to figure out what is reinforcing enough for him to want to go in the cage. Once that is figured out you can click - treat (timing is important) and he will quickly learn the behavior of going in the cage.

Behavior has function, it happens for a reason. That's the part we need to watch and learn. There is a reason BoBo flies off - something happens - if you can figure out what is causing it you can change it.

IIRC BoBo is clipped. This is getting long but I have to add this. Clipping more off his wings will only take away more freedom of choice and "could" cause side effects. In my opinion BoBo is easy to read, he doesn't want to do something so off he goes. Take away that choice and yes it's easier for you at this time. The part I wonder about is does the bird give up (learned helplessness) and do what you want because he has no choice? If that is the case, I also wonder what it does to the bird physiologically.

This got a little long but I wanted to touch on these things. If I can be of any help, which is difficult and time consuming over the internet, I would be more than willing to discuss this in more detail.

These are my thoughts on your post, so take it for what it's worth.

PS FWIW - IIRC=If I remember correctly

[Ginny]

WOW Jim Great post. I think you said that well and it all makes sense if you stop and think about it.
Thank you so much for the info. :wub:

[Jim]

Hello Ginny

Been a while since I've posted to you. How are you and the birds doing?

Thanks for the comment... but ya know... I almost deleted it. :doh: I thought it sounded like I was against clipping, which I'm not, to each his own I say.:shrug:

Wish I had a DVD hookup in the back of my head so people could *see* what I'm thinking... :scratchch it never seems to come out my fingers like I see it.:rolleyes:

[Ginny]

Hi Jim,

Thanks for asking about me. We are all fine. As for the birds they are spoiled as ever. How are you and your birds doing?

I am glad you didn't delete the post. I think you said it well. It is good to hear what works for other people. You can always get new ideas from others and that is what this board is all about. What works for some might not work for others but it is good to hear all the different things that work for the different birds and then we can choose to try or not try them.

I always enjoy your wisdom and ideas and the things you post.

Have a great weekend.

[Jim]

How are you and your birds doing?We're doing fine, Thanks. Don't know if you know but Sharon has been gone, so me and the boys have been *Home Alone* since last Sunday.:rolleyes: We think we're this macho crew, (ya right) but we're looking forward to her being back this Sunday.:)

[Ginny]

:yikes: OH NO 3 guys *home alone*:scareboo: ....... Now that is real scary.


Just make sure you get your mess all cleaned up before she gets home. :help:


Enjoy your last few days :beerchug:

[Jean]

We're doing fine, Thanks. Don't know if you know but Sharon has been gone, so me and the boys have been *Home Alone* since last Sunday.:rolleyes: We think we're this macho crew, (ya right) but we're looking forward to her being back this Sunday.:)

You sound so brave being "Home Alone" :scratchch I have an idea you are lonesome like AL when it comes to missing your sweetie. :heart: I hate to leave him and Elvie, he looks so lonesome and lost with one of our flock gone.

This one is for you and the boys.:grouphug:

[mickey8978]

He fell in love with a spoon? How adorable. And he won't let you have it. Too funny. I'm sure there are others on here who can help with advice on his training. I'll kick this back up to the top so someone can see the message.

That is funny. Pets keep us laughing. That is why we have them. Why else would we go through all we do? It is because we love them and ultimately find their behavior entertaining, even though it is frustrating sometimes.

[mickey8978]

That is funny. Pets keep us laughing. That is why we have them. Why else would we go through all we do? It is because we love them and ultimately find their behavior entertaining, even though it is frustrating sometimes.